Senator Rand Paul (R-KY) gave Dr. Anthony Fauci one final opportunity to answer a direct question about the possible destruction of federal records, only to hear the same Fifth Amendment response three times in a row. Paul pointed to Fauci’s presidential pardon and told him the committee considered the objection unsupported for a question confined to the pardon period. The chairman then announced that the committee was scheduled to vote the following week on a resolution certifying Fauci’s contempt.
The exchange came near the end of the July 29th hearing before the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee, which Paul chairs. Fauci had appeared under subpoena and delivered an opening statement before declining to answer the committee’s questions on the advice of counsel. Paul used his closing round to return to the pardon, the asserted privilege, and a specific question involving federal records.
“Let’s be clear today. You know what we’ve seen,” Paul began. “I really did want to hear from Dr. Fauci. I wanted to hear perhaps an apology, perhaps some semblance of being sorry for what happened, or that judgment errors were made.” He said the committee had heard none of that and instead watched Fauci refuse to answer after being directed by the chair.
In the exchange captured in this clip, Paul said Fauci had cited a privilege that was unsupported because of his pardon. Paul also argued that Fauci had waived the privilege by testifying at the beginning of the hearing. He offered Fauci what he described as one final chance to comply with the law before his refusal to answer would be escalated.
“I’m going to give you one more opportunity to comply with the law, limited to the period of your pardon,” Paul said. He narrowed the question to the period between January 1, 2014, and January 19, 2025, before asking: “Did you destroy any federal record or tell anyone else to?” Fauci did not answer the substance of the question and instead invoked his constitutional rights.
“Under the advice of counsel, I respectfully decline to answer based upon my rights under the Fifth Amendment to the Constitution,” Fauci replied. Paul immediately pressed him on the basis for that refusal, asking, “Given that you have an unlimited presidential pardon, what is your specific objection that you are making?” Fauci repeated the same response, again citing the advice of counsel and the Fifth Amendment.
Watch Paul grilling Fauci here:
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Paul then emphasized that his question had been confined to the dates covered by the pardon. “My question was limited to the period of your pardon only,” he said. “I find your objection unsupported and direct you to answer the question.” Fauci once more declined, using the same scripted answer he had already given twice.
The repeated refusal left the committee without an answer as to whether Fauci had destroyed any federal record or instructed another person to do so during the specified period. Fauci gave no substantive response to the question, but looked visibly uncomfortable and anxious throughout the encounter.
The senator moved directly to the procedural consequence he said would follow from Fauci’s refusal to comply with the chairman’s direction. “Because you refuse to answer, citing a privilege that is unsupported because of your pardon,” Paul said, “this committee is scheduled to vote next week on a resolution certifying your contempt.”
Featured image credit: screengrab from the embedded video.